it’s like you believe you can tariff them expecting they won’t do the same. Why do you believe the rest of the world is not going to retaliate and why do you believe America can prosper without the rest of the world?
What’s the point of having a military alliance with countries you puts tariffs on? That’s unfriendly to say the least.
I’m pretty sure the only Republicans here are people who believe in Republicanism (the political ideology)
Ideology? GTFO with that communism libtard! /s
Oh no I have just been epically owned :3 /s /j
Soon, comments will need more flags than a C compiler.
I’m not a Republican, but I’ll bite.
The U.S. is kinda in a bad spot right now. Not just politically but economically as well. Our National Debt is the highest it’s ever been. While I’m 100% for taxing Billionaires and their Trillion dollars companies more, by like, a lot, the Billionaires of course don’t want that. So they’re trying to cut what they can and wheel and deal. Why support Climate Change (French EU thing, I don’t remember) acts when you can [pocket the money] use that to pay down debt? The War in Ukraine has unfortunately been drawn out too long for us to stay financially invested in it. Our allies across the sea won’t be able to help our country balance our debt when they have Ukraine to worry about as well. So they’ve decided to put pressure on every external source of revenue while cutting what they can without getting lynched.
Let’s talk about Canada and Mexico, but first, a bit of H I S T O R Y. Back in the 90s or 00s the Clinton Administration implemented NAFTA. The agreement sounded good on paper: Strength our border countries. Lifts us all up by giving all the countries jobs, more opportunity, more demand. While outsourcing our manual labor we can focus on the future: Technology! Hindsight is 20/20 though. Why not move our business to a country where we pay lower wages and will end up with higher profits for future investments (like yachts)? Why not get cheaper parts instead of paying the U.S. prices? A ton of manual labor jobs were lost, and many cities (car manufacturing cities, steel cities, etc.) simply never recovered. NAFTA stayed in place more or less until Trump Trumped it into the USMCA in 2020. That gets renegotiated in 2026 with all 3 countries either coming to an agreement or dissolving the agreement.
From all accounts, NAFTA certainly seemed harmful to the American industry at the time, but can that industry recover, and should it? Personally, I don’t think so, but they seem to think so. So, from my point of view, the reason they’re alienating allies is to extort them for money to help pay down the National Debt and hopefully grow back American industries lost over 2 decades ago.
Not a Republican. I assume Trump is making backroom personal deals to get the world’s politicians and businesses to bribe him in some way. Aligns with how he seems to operate with everything else.
Business leaders can pay $5mil to have a candlelit dinner with Trump so I’m not sure how backroom these deals really are lol
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If they were capable of thinking critically, they wouldn’t be Republicans in the first place.
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In the United States war and martial law does not stop the election cycle. There is zero precedent to support this, even Roosevelt had to campaign during WW2. In fact, the constitution is quite clear on the opposite - it perscribes elections must be held, offering no mechanisms for deferment.
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Ditto for the Constitution
“What’s the point?” The point is to seize power and get rich.
They will destroy whatever they want or need in order to become rich and powerful.
and to deliever america (and greenland and canada) to russia, for their master Putin.
I imagine it’s so no one would be willing to come to our aid as he destroys the country.
Simple bully logic. If you are bigger than someone else, simply hit and threaten them to get whatever you want. Works really well until all the victims gang up and fight back together.
Isolationism and tribalism.
Make your people believe the rest of the world are against them and they’ll look to you for leadership. It’s not just the US - Europe and the UK have also had a rise in jingoism, fuelled by inflated reports of immigrants.
The Sassanians alienated their Lakhmid allies -forcefully annexed them and slaughtered their ruling dynasty-. Everyone knows what happened to the Sassanians not too long afterwards.
Who knows if history will repeat itself but worth waiting and finding out.
Edit: not sure why this is getting downvoted. I gave an example of an empire which at the height of its military might went through a period of political instability which lead to it turning against one of its major allies which eventually brought its downfall. The parallels are obvious, but whether we will get a repeat of the outcome or not, is yet to be seen. The replies are as-if the Sassanians are a little unknown empire at the edge of the world rather than one that was at one point an equal to Rome.
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Simple actually, it’s the good-ol American Exceptionalism kool-aid
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Engineers from Taiwan that have chip design skills? Yes, they can walk at any time.
You’re taking a general case of H1B visa abuse–which is completely valid in broad terms–and applying it to a specialized case where the materials conditions are different.
You do it by incentivizing building factories, up to the point where a company can be competitive with those outsourced industries. Something kind of like the CHIPS act that Trump just axed. Random and blanket tariffs will not help. Tariffs can mainly only help prevent an industry from leaving. For example, we have huge tariffs on Chinese EVs because they would outcompete every US manufactured EV and we would lose those jobs.
The reality is that it’s very difficult to take a centrist position here. Trump’s tariffs make no sense. They will not bring back any jobs because no one is going to build a factory in the next 4 years if there’s a chance the next president reverses Trump’s decision.
It’s also a bad move to tariff our main allies because not only does it make things more expensive for Americans, it erodes trust in our nation and destabilizes our position of dominance globally. In the eyes of the world, we’ve gone from stable and reliable to dangerous and unpredictable. It will take a lot more than 4 years to recover from that.
The big worry people have is a potential incoming economic crash. We’re already dealing with a very weak labor market, uncomfortably high inflation, irrational stock valuations, and high housing prices. If now a huge wave of federal layoffs, which will likely result in instability of federal programs many Americans rely on, hits at the same time as what will essentially be artificially caused inflation through tariffs, it could send things into a downward spiral.
Well said and I agree :)
I’m having a hard time following. How is the trade war going to lead to recovering outsourced jobs? Isn’t it more likely to cause businesses to decrease their US operations?
The reason why jobs are outsourced is so companies can take advantage of cheaper labor and operation costs. Other than sending the us economy into a downward spiral that makes people want to work at slave level wages… Not seeing the connection.
Well the people will still need that things that were imported, eventually you’ll have to have an industry to cover that need. Picture this just an extreme case. All clothes are made abroad, imagine the tariff makes it “unbuyables”. The people will still have the need for clothes so that creates the space for someone to start making clothes and sell them eventually making a textile industry.
Now the problem is this could take years the internal industry could be shit and a myriad of other problems that will surely will affect the poorest people the most. Economics explained has a good video on it you should check it.How does creating a local industry of cheap knockoffs help the US economy exactly? What you’re describing is turning the United States into a random poorer country. That plan only makes sense if the ultimate goal is to diminish the United States economy and its influence in the world. That benefits China and India. It doesn’t benefit the United States domestically.
Here’s a better idea, invest in your people to create an economy and society that doesn’t rely upon raping other country for labor and materials.
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You understand that the only way the current economic policy results in what you’re suggesting is everybody is brought down to such a desperate place that they are willing to work for pennies to possibly feed their family crumbs. All because the corporations that are paying the wages want 98% profit, not 97% profit. And the reason is national security concerns? If you’re worried about national security concerns then why base a solution on capitalism? We are putting more and more power and placing more and more preference on the corporation as opposed to the individual. A corporation does not give two shits about national security concerns. The only thing they care about is how can we use national security breaches to make more money.
Therefore, your line of reasoning just doesn’t make any sense. It assumes that you live in a world that doesn’t exist. Furthermore, it completely ignores the source of the problem: unregulated capitalism. If your national security is dependent upon your economic policy, you’re doing things wrong.
this could take years the internal industry could be shit and a myriad of other problems that will surely will affect the poorest people the most.
Yes, and it will be expensive either way. When you buy a bag of imported tube socks for $5. You’ve got tube socks in a fair trade. When you pay $20, you have 4x less tube socks. The foreign seller can still buy US agriculture, resources, or houses, or bonds to lower our interest rates with the money without forcing you to overpay for tube socks. Globalization has multidirectional benefits.
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I think your point is, first the tube socks go to $20. Then someone (maybe a Chinese who is now global expert in sock making) in US figures out a way to make them for $19, 2 years after their investment.
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That position has a few inaccurate assumptions. The first being that the machines of capitalism, corporate entities, are tied to geographical regions. Today Apple could just move its base of operations to a country. Willing to have it. That isn’t the US. All the company cares about is profit. It doesn’t care about profit while having its base of operations in the United States. If the political climate is too unpredictable and the profits aren’t easily obtainable, they’re going to move to some place where the profits are more easily obtainable.
Another assumption you’re making is that capitalism is the only solution. It really doesn’t make sense addressing this assumption. If you believe one way, my words on the internet aren’t going to make you believe it another way.
But another assumption implied in your thesis is that bringing back jobs is going to fix the problem. This conclusion fails to consider the fundamental nature of capitalism. Capitalism only prevails when there is constant growth of profit and more importantly for your position, growth of the consumer base. The reason why the United States were such successful Capitalists, was because of our booming population Post world war II. You had this constantly increasing stream of consumers that are necessary for the companies to make profit along with a stable and ever-growing manufacturing base. Those conditions don’t currently exist in the United States.
To that end, the countries at an advantage for the next capitalistic explosion are those with huge populations like India and China. So trying to win the international battle of capitalism is a losing proposition for the United States in the foreseeable future.
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Which businesses? Foreign companies or local ones? Do you wish to have your money shipped overseas to purchase a vacuum cleaner? Or would you rather pay a bit more and have you hard earned dollars stay here in at home to help pay wages to your neighbors?
Does the foreign vacuum work better? Is it more compact? Are the technologies it is built on protected by IP law? If it’s a cheap junk crescent wrench that I’ll use once because I need it only once, I’d rather not pay double for quality.
Who do you think transfers more money out of this country. The individual citizens buying vacuum cleaners, or corporations and billionaires who funneled their money to tax havens overseas. The only people harmed by the current economic policy are individuals trying to feed their families. Corporations are making more money than ever before. The wealthiest people in the world are more wealthy than they ever have been in recent history.
But you know what? Let’s just put all the blame and responsibilty on the families. They should have bought their vacuum cleaners from cousin Billy down the street. The shitty economy is all their fault.
Do you hear how silly that sounds?
Maybe something like the chips act … which he just repealed.
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Honestly asking: what other way would anyone suggest to bring back outsourced manufacturing jobs?
Probably with some sort of long term plan instead of randomly turning sweeping tariffs on and off.
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Honestly asking: what other way would anyone suggest to bring back outsourced manufacturing jobs?
Currency rate between US/China to drop 3x or more. That is also solution to US debt. Doubling down on dead ender energy will create high cost of living, not just from climate related insurance rates, but for expensive manufacturing energy, and need to pay high wages just to have home affordability.
Destroying NA auto industry will destroy it instead of auto companies writing off investments in Canada/Mexico to reinvest in US declining market that is smaller and uncompetitive. Massive auto subsidies would be needed, but still no export markets. Auto sector trade with Canada has a US surplus, with Canadians have specialized skill in parts making.
Manufacturing only makes sense if there is export potential for good products. Boeing and Caterpillar and US weapons getting blacklisted by world is bad. UAW cheering on Trump NA tariffs won’t be forgotten. Blacklisting US agriculture means their share of massive subsidies.
The future (present in China) of manufacturing is robotics. There are plenty of jobs in constructing factories, but those are cheaper in other countries, and the best robot/manufacturing companies are in China. Trump has hinted at welcoming Chinese FDI in US manufacturing, but that would be factory construction jobs more than significant permanent manual labour jobs. UAW won’t love that move.
Start by taxing the shit out of the CEOs and board of directors, with a mechanism built into the taxation so that any increase in their compensation is entirely offset by an increase in taxes. Then offer incentives to on-shore labor again.
This is the way.
Richard Nixon was great at weaponizing taxes against windfall profits to the benefit of the people. Also, if I recall correctly, this sort of taxation is partly why the US prospered so much from the 40’s to the 60’s.
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All the more reason to stop voting Democrat and pull the lever for the Green candidate instead.
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He’s out of line, but he’s right.
Blue MAGA wanting to start WW3
Lol. Please expand on this.
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I guess with their support for a live-streamed genocide
That’s a pretty glossed over way of telling us you don’t understand global politics and why America isn’t going to alienate their most important ally in the Middle East. A country expressing displeasure with the way their ally is interacting with another nation but remaining their ally because of the geo-political importance is not “blue MAGA (lol)” starting WW3. Nothing about America remaining allies with Israel starts WW3.
Full-throated support for a proxy war that threatens to turn nuclear with Russia.
Lol. You mean America supporting a democratic nation that was invaded by our greatest adversary so they can use their soldiers to prevent us from using ours to stop Russia from expanding their borders and their influence? Not only is that helping not start WW3 because we don’t have to get directly involved with Russia, but no one is going nuclear because it doesn’t benefit anyone.
Threatening hot war with China throughout the Biden admin.
Source your statements. No one is just going to believe you, especially after saying things like “blue MAGA”.
Escalating tensions with the DPRK
Source your statements.
backing a coup attempt in South Korea.
Source your statements.
Continued support for destabilization of leftist countries in South & Central America.
Source your statements.
Honestly, I’m not going to keep saying it. You keep making wild statements you expect us to take your word for. Source every statement you said or I can’t take you seriously. You just typed a lot of words to condemn Democrats for their handling of foreign affairs while 100% utterly and completely declining to acknowledge Republican’s categorical destruction of our relationships with virtually all our allies over the course of a single month.
It’s pretty obvious you’re a shill.
And stop saying “blue MAGA”. It makes you look ridiculous.
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So you’re openly admitting you can’t support any of the ridiculous statements you made?
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Nah loser.
You don’t seem to understand.
You made obscene statements and are now refusing to back them up, because you’re wrong AND lazy.
I didn’t make dipshit statements.
You did.
Back them up or continue being the clown loser you already are.
I don’t think there is any way to bring back those jobs. You guys are dreaming if you think you can just go back to an economy of the past.
The world has globalized, America can’t just pretend it hasn’t. Sure you can try and bring everything in house but by alienating allies there are lots of things you just can’t get yourselves like many raw materials, and then you need to worry about exporting to actually bring money into your economy not just move it around in circles.
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Plus there’s no one saying you can’t reduce reliance on specific countries like China. It is indeed dangerous to rely on any one country for too much. But if you spread it out to many countries and make sure to have some domestic supply for the most important things it would be fine.
At the moment Trump is targeting all countries, and many for no reason at all.
It is indeed dangerous to rely on any one country for too much
Cries in Canadian
China also doesn’t want to interrupt trade, it benefits them just as much as America, that’s how. They won’t invade Taiwan if there’s a threat of war disrupting trade.
If you isolate the country from China too much then there is no benefit to China not invading. Globalization encourages peace because trade benefits all. Russia is suffering from all their sanctions now, they made a mistake thinking things would be over in a few days and people would get over it. Now they need to grit their teeth and pull through it. No one else wants to be Russia.
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Do they? As much as we like to play it quiet, the US exports a lot of food globally- China gets some $17b worth. Those tend to be perishable, so any hot war would have to be over quickly for China to come outahead, and any protracted war would see them need a new breadbasket eother domestic (reducing the industrial/military work pool), or international (which comes with the same risks they have now over US ties).
China isn’t reliant on imported food, from the US or anywhere.
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Why wouldn’t China do exactly the same mistake in some point?
As European I would advice against the trust that the strong economic ties would keep totalitarians in check.
Plus, think about the logistics of that.
Goods produced in the US are categorically more expensive due to infrastructure, cost of living (and therefore wage expectations). If we could wave a magic wand to transplant an effective manufacturing facility from Pakistan and place it in rural Mississippi, hire Americans to do the work, and begin pumping out goods, the price to produce the goods would increase substantially.
Americans wouldn’t be able to afford American made goods, which is true even now. Many Americans try to buy American “when possible”, but cost quickly outweighs patriotism.
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There is a balance to it. Yes, local manufacturing will make things more expensive. But making more durable goods tends to pay better wages for more people. And let’s be honest here, most people can’t be a doctor or write code. High paying collage degrees are beyond them. Or we can maintain low paying retail jobs for the majority of people.
But the is a balance and it can’t be done over night without causing large amounts of economic pain to many people.
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Canada isnt a significant threat to US manufacturing, so why the tariffs on Canada?
China would make sense, but Canada? Why?
Honestly asking: what other way would anyone suggest to bring back outsourced manufacturing jobs?
The bigger question is “do Americans actually want these jobs?” According to the JOLTS surveys for the last several quarters there’s about 100,000 open manufacturing jobs that are not getting filled, in a labor market sized about 500,000. Simply put, it’s abundantly clear that people don’t want the manufacturong jobs that do exist
I also saw this from the inside when I worked my last job with a company that does contract cleaning services for industrial facilities. Nobody wants to work industrial sanitation, and they end up primarily hiring immigrants and ex-convicts as they’re the only people desperate enough to take these industrial sanitation jobs. And it’s not for lack of pay or benefits, the fact is the nature of the work sucks!
Stock market manipulation. Look at who moved in to make big trades after the market plunged. Follow the money.
The president is a Russian asset
