I’ve got no problem with them, but these are obviously kids who grew up in a different age than me, and it shows, I know what could seem a joke to me could come off different to them. Especially this being In the trades and the type of jokes we make here. I don’t want to make anyone uncomfortable, we’re all trying to just get through the day after all
Edit: I have learned, they used to be female, transitioned to male. (So trans-masc? I’m probably messing that up) Lesbian, and non-binary, thankfully they brought it up which was very helpful as I wasn’t sure if it was appropriate to ask
Call me whatever you want at this point, but if it comes down to “A [type of person] has shown up at my job, what topics should I avoid?” it’s time to start updating the resume.
Reactions like this do nothing to further anything. Pointing at a post where someone acknowledges their lack of understanding and ignorance, a post where someone is trying to be more open and accepting, and telling them that they are the problem and should give up is as close minded and bigoted as the person you’re making OP out to be
Someone that lacks empathy?
Things I am likely to say to my team at work:
“I emailed you an STL. Please print two of them, and be ready to print 18 more if the customer approves.”
“Put on your safety glasses.”
“The lathe’s coolant pump is not working, I think it may be the contactor. Take a look at it when you first clock in tomorrow and let me know what parts we need if any; I’m going to need it up and running by Thursday.”
“Safety glasses go on the front of your head, not the top.”
“SomeCo has our steel order ready, take the company truck and pick it up. Make sure to get a copy of the P.O.”
“Put. On. Your safety glasses.”
“How’s it coming on those base plates? Can we get started on the brackets yet or are we still waiting?”
“If you get vitreous humor on my drill press, you’re the one that’s gonna clean it up.”
If you can’t handle being spoken to in this manner, you are not going to last long on my team.
Those are not the only words you utter at work. Don’t be ridiculous.
You are completely and entirely missing the point of this post.
When new people from different cultures or backgrounds assimilate into a new work place, being culturally sensitive is expected and the standard.
Yeah I’m more or less with the Republicans on this one. Either you’re suffering from gender dysphoria, and you should seek treatment from qualified mental health personnel, or you went on Tumblr as a tweenager and instead of being a greaser or punk or goth you’re “trans.” Either way, this is not your employer or coworker’s problem.
Gender dysphoria is a mental problem, in the sense that it causes mental distress to be in the wrong body. The treatment is not therapy, it’s surgery to correct the body to fit the mind. A therapist can help identify the cause of the distress, but if the cause is the body then that therapist will recommend surgery.
I recall seeing research suggesting that trans people’s brainwaves more closely match that of their “desired” gender than that of their sex. It reinforces the idea that being transgender isn’t a mental issue, it’s a physical issue that causes mental distress.
A trans man isn’t a woman who merely thinks she’s a man, it’s actually a man inside that skull. Only the body underneath it is wrong. It’s as if tomorrow you woke up in the body of the opposite gender. That will (after the novelty wears off) start distressing you. Trans people didn’t wake up like that, they were born with that feeling.
As expected, a complete lack of empathy
You’re right. If that dude works with you, I’d also suggest them to brush up their resume.
Empathy is a really stupid idea when all you’ll ever be is what people can extract from you.
Hey there, who hurt you so bad you gave empathy all together?
It must strain a lot of brain cells parroting ol musky.
I’m trans, and have also worked with trans kids. Sometimes outed myself when it was safe - showing young trans men that yes, you can be a man.
It really comes down to “what name and pronouns would you me to call you by?”
If you want to go above and beyond: “would you like me to correct/step in for you if someone calls you by the wrong names/pronouns?” I feel this is a place where adult advocates can have good impact.
“Does your family know/should I use your legal name when talking to your family?”
See the child as a person who deserves dignity and respect, who is in a vulnerable position and does need unconditional support. Which is true for all children. You don’t have to put up a progress flag or wear a rainbow pin - these can certainly be very good things to do - but at the end of the day, just honor the child.
Trans people are weird, but so is everyone else.
Ehhhhhh, I get what you’re trying to say, but also, yikes?
Please elaborate, I don’t get what you’re implying.
Hey, Non-binary trans masc person in trades here.
I can tell you how I perceive different types of co-worker if it helps you want to dial in what it’s like on the other side of the experience. There’s layers to the whole situation and as non-binary folks we understand what we are asking for isn’t automatically going to click and requires people to figure us out.
First up : Most of us end of day aren’t going to rock the boat for anything less than fully agregious behaviour so calls to report other people for being mildly offensive are probably not actually going to go anywhere. Most of us are scared of being labelled “a problem” so we just take the hits when they come. If you are a boss and notice a non-binary person sticking closer to specific people and avoiding others there’s a good chance that they’ve found the people who are safe and avoiding ones who aren’t. A great accommodation that can invisibly help is just to recognize this strata and if a task nessesitates putting people together try and pair along these lines. A lot of co-workers wait until other people aren’t around to let their nastier behaviour shine.
Now to co-worker types. Aside from the full on transphobe or problem persons there’s a range of different stages of cool people.
The “I don’t really get it” Co-worker pays lip service to the polite aspects of using pronouns. They are the type to introduce you to others by misgendering you and then flap their hands and go “Oh no sorry ‘they’”. We know they don’t get it or don’t really care. The misgendering still hurts but they are fairly benign. They make these accidents non maliciously and are afforded grace. If they step in it we basically disregard because they aren’t really worth the effort of getting too comfortable around. We make these accommodations for strangers daily. Annoying but nessisary.
The “in training” co-worker is one whom is encountering their very first trans person. They want you to be their Obi wan and their enthusiasm is a bit of a double edged sword at times. It’s tiring to teach people to dance when they keep stepping on your feet but the job needs doing. Some of us veiw this as our own brand of service to the cause of normalizing ourselves more widely. Some of us just don’t want to be bothered. Either way, just wanting to learn is heaps better than ambivalence. If you fuck up something, don’t make a big deal about it. It’s not that you’re a terrible person and should have known better. Our stuff takes practice and we know it’s not intuitive.
The “A little too up in our shit” co-worker is excited to know the real you but looks at you as a beautiful creature in need of preservation. They might seek to advocate on your behalf or behind your back but the attempt is clumsy and often at odds with a non-binary person’s desire to just get through the workday as a regular human and not make waves. Good enthusiasm sure, we’re probably friends but for the love of God we’re adults and we can sort out our own shit if need be.
The “Understands the Assignment” co-worker is just comfortable to be around. They don’t have to be the most tuned in to all the nuance about our specific needs in ways we require more out of partners, family and friends but they treat our basic requirements as no big deal, maybe they occasionally ask questions to check in if they catch us struggling or reacting but aren’t going to narc to the boss on our behalf. They either avoid all stereotypes associated with sex or in the case of trans mascs/trans femmes they treat us like one of the boys/girls. Gold standard.
Just be yourself & be open. There’ll always be troublemakers on all sides
Respect them for who they are, and listen to them if they tell you you’re fucking it up, just like you would with anyone else. It’s almost as if trans people are just people. ;)
Treat them like any other person. Their gender/identity should have absolutely zero impact on the ability to do their job. So you don’t even need to ask this question. If you feel like you’re walking on eggshells and scared of bringing up an offensive topic, then that’s an issue with you, not with them. There’s nothing that you say that should be offending them since it’s absolutely irrelevant to work.
Regardless of who your coworkers are, topics like gender identity or politics should NEVER be discussed in the workplace. If you simply avoid engaging in those types of topics then you will be safe. Talking about those things at work is an absolute horrendous idea, regardless of who the coworkers are. Those convos don’t belong in the workplace.
I think some politics is healthy to talk about in certain work situations. Definitely not the red vs blue tribal nonsense, but discussing and understanding material conditions
The only politics that should be discussed at work are policies that directly impact the business. For example, my company has many conversations and meetings around impacts from Trump’s tariffs. No one gives an opinion on what their politics are. Not a single one. We discuss the impact on the business and how we can mitigate them. It ends there.
I think many workplaces function better when workers are able to develop camaraderie by talking and joking about things that aren’t strictly related to work
There are plenty of other things to joke around and talk about, aside from politics.
When someone starts complaining about what bathroom everyone is using, you can’t just ignore it and hope it goes away. It’s your job as their superior to address these issues.
Similarly,
Their gender/identity should have absolutely zero impact on the ability to do their job.
Making this stance clear requires talking about gender identity and politics.
If you struggle with pronouns, apologize casually when the pronouns come up.
As a fellow old, the kids don’t seem to necessarily get it that my brain is wired pretty hard not to change pronouns, but they do seem to appreciate the effort and the discussion that it’s a challenge rather than just fucking it up with no explanation.
Otherwise, be mindful that they take a lot of shit for parts of themselves that are background attributes for the rest of us. They can get pretty tired of it. A friendly person who regards them as just people may be the best thing they can get from anyone.
You’re not a dick for getting someone’s pronouns wrong… You’re a dick if you intentionally and continuously misgender them on purpose.
Well, I have had two people tell me very rudely that I’m an asshole because I got their pronoun wrong because they had it at the start of the presentation somewhere. And I also have had dozens more who corrected me politely a couple of times and then I’d just remember the right pronouns.
Assholes are assholes magrinalized or not.
I still mess up my sister’s spouse. They’re NB, but kept their name, hobbies, etc. To me, they’re the exact same awesome person they’ve always been, so I still screw up and call them by male pronouns.
I 100% support them, but I screw up and it feels bad.
Exactly. Sure it sucks when it happens by accident, but it’s to be expected to some extent. It’s when someone is doing it intentionally to fuck with you that it really gets under your skin. It’s disrespectful.
Treat them like anyone else by default and make accommodations if you need to and it’s reasonable.
You’re asking with good intentions, but the best answer for any group will always be that. Shit, not even by groups. On a human by human basis just do that, there’s a crazy amount of human variation and it’s not always obvious.
This is not a comprehensive list, but you should probably avoid talking about your sex life.
oh hi mark
good advice for any workplace
But I’m a hooker
then let your clients fill in the blanks, even if that’s letting them believe this is your first time. unless you think you can charoe extra for that. then do
Yes.
First of all, good for you for asking the question. I think many people are afraid to ask these things even if they want to be respectful and inclusive for fear of coming off as backward or ignorant, but I think asking questions in good faith shows that we’re willing to listen and learn.
But most importantly, just treat them with the same respect you’d treat anyone else! Gender identity isn’t really that big of a deal, and after you get to know some trans folks you’ll come to that realization quickly that they’re just regular people!
Since there already are a lot of good answers, do it like in Full Metal Jacket “I don’t look down on you if you’re x, y, z or something - you’re all equally worthless”
The thing most people get wrong is mentioning someone’s assigned gender (the one they were supposed to have) instead of the one they actually are. Being reminded constantly of the one thing you absolutely don’t want to be is really disheartening, even when it’s not done on purpose.
It’s minor but I probably wouldn’t say supposed to have sounds like they are wrong
I edited it to “presumed to have at birth”.
Your comment highlights one of the difficulties I find with going between treating someone exactly as you would anyone else, while also dealing with particular sensitivities or sensibilities of that person. Even trying to describe how to be less offensive, includes wording that can sound offensive to some, justifiably so based on experience.
But all in all, I think most people will recognize good faith efforts and accept quick apologies and corrections when we make mistakes. We’re not perfect.
Completely agree and it doesn’t help that it’s an ever moving goalpost. I feel like most people understand that as long as you are acting in good faith it’s all fine.
Well, I think it’s of upmost importance to hire a private security firm to guard the bathrooms. Anyone entering or exiting those bathrooms will now be required to submit to a genital confirmation. We’ll have tighter security on those bathrooms than TSA guarding the airports from unauthorized water bottles, and 2 inch pocket knifes.
Because as we all know, urinating into a toilet, surrounded by makeshift stall walls, can be the most offensive thing in the world if you don’t share the same set of genitals as everyone else in the world! Especially since those stslls intentionally leave a gap, so we can spy on others as their peeing. That’s how important these genitals in bathrooms are! Gotta follow all the correct protocol for emptying your bladder!
I say all this to say that yesterday I peed on a tree outside, and nobody gives a shit.
As for your coworkers? Just make a concentrated effort to remember what they prefer as their gender so you don’t say “she” instead of “he”.
The only one that confuses me is “they”, but it’s still refering to just one person. Luckily I don’t know anyone like that, because that one I’m sure I’d constantly accidently fuck up.
The only one that confuses me is “they”, but it’s still refering to just one person. Luckily I don’t know anyone like that, because that one I’m sure I’d constantly accidently fuck up.
I ran into a person a long time ago on Lemmy that asked that people use ‘it/its’ as pronouns. Even for second person- so not they/them/you/yours, it/its. Absolutely broke my brain.
I saw that once on fetlife, but I assumed that was a sex thing. The whole profile was based around this guy being degraded, and humiliated, but he kept refering to himself in the 3rd person as “it”.
I didn’t realize that was another gender identity. I just thought it was a fetish thing.
